Yep, thats a lake alright. Wow standing water on the surface of Mars. And this isn't the only image of its kind. Anyone remember when ESA's Mars Express reported water traces at the south pole? There was an image that looked like a river in the bottom of a canyon.

Here are some pics...
Hope this link works:
http://asimov.esrin.esa.int:8766/queryIG.html?col=mmg&ht=0&qp=&qs=&qc=&pw=100%25&ws=1&la=en&si=0&fs=&op0=&fl0=ContentType%3A&ty0=w&tx0=+&op1=&fl1=ContentType%3A&ty1=w&tx1=Image+Video+Audio+&op2=&fl2=ContentType%3A&ty2=w&tx2=&op3=|%2B&fl3=topica%3A&ty3=w&tx3=&op4=|%2B&fl4=subtopic%3A&ty4=w&tx4=&op5=|%2B&fl5=&ty5=p&tx5=mars&op6=|%2B&fl6=program%3A&ty6=p&tx6=&op7=|%2B&fl7=mission%3A&ty7=p&tx7=&op8=|%2B&fl8=month%3A&ty8=p&tx8=&op9=|%2B&fl9=year%3A&ty9=p&tx9=&op10=|%2B&fl10=id%3A&ty10=p&tx10=&op11=|%2B&fl11=showcase%3A&ty11=p&tx11=ESA00000000&qt=&ex=&rq=0&oq=&searchType=keyword&qm=0&ql=a&tipo=All&showcase=All&st=49&nh=12&lk=8&rf=3

The image also indicates that there was a slow process of evaporation, notice the layered rings at differing levels.

Great images Prozac: Thanks

gyroscopes on ISS stop functioning and only the shuttle can deliver replacements. They had better do this quickly or there will be no station to bring them to soon. Nasa needs to think out side of the box for getting back into space or we will loose face with all the staions partners.

The dome-shaped station gyroscopes each are 600 pounds or 290 kg, essentially a 4-foot spinning wheel. Does not sound like this would be a very hard to deliver item. Does any one else have more exact details on gyro's demensions?

I do not know the gyro's dimensions but I am cocncerned about our engineering skill in this project - besides the gyro failure their have been air leaks, faulty EVA suits and even things that go bump in the night. Surely after skylab & MIR we should have perfected this technology by now. If we are still struggling with these basics are we deluding ourselves to have the capability to send a mission to Mars esecially one with a living capsule roatating around the engine & fuel tank module to create a sense of gravity.

It appears we are spending enormous sums of money but cant get the basics right - A previous mission to Mars ( I forget the name ) failed because engineers mixed up imperial and metric dimensions... This is school boy type of error. The Beagle "disappeared" because they underestimated the Martian Atmosphere density but we could land probes there back in the seventies.

Have we learnt anything new since the Apolo missions where robust engineering and innovation succeeded in getting man to the moon in 8 years yet today its going to take us 13 years to do the same thing.

Its like flying hypersonic London - New York in 30 minutes but you must check in at the airport 3 hours before departure and it takes you 2 hours to clear customs the other side. Improved technology destroyed by bureaucracy.

Sorry guys .. I am only someone with an interest in space exploration and even I get frustrated.. pity those actually making careers in this environment.

Mike

My thoughts exactly Mike. The drive and ambition to get people on the Moon no longer exists. 3 astronauts burned to death at the start of the apollo program, did we stop? No, we fixed the door, lowered the oxygen levels and went on. These days if an asronaut so much as stubs his/her toe, the space program comes to a grinding halt and years of investigation and commities ensues.
This is a generation more concerned with who will be the next manufactured 'Idol' or which rapper is now in trouble with the law. We live in a time where rigged shows are called reality television, and leaders can convince the general population that we are fighting to liberate men that treat the women in their lives like animals.
It won't be the US that colonizes Mars or the Moon, we have no reason too. We are too busy getting fat and stupid. Countries like China, Japan, India and the European community have the motivation to colonize and therefore be the next superpower. History truly does repeat itself. We have learned nothing of the importance of exploration. A society that doesn't grow, dies, it is that simple.
The U.S. is the latest colonizing effort. It is made up of decendants whose roots reach around the globe. Countries that helped build this country now enjoy favored status with us and benefit in countless ways.
Mars will be the next great experiment. Countries will again send their best and brightest to a new place. The challenges that these people face will mold them into the most productive and innovative people of their time. Soon everyone will look to Mars for answers like the world values (or used to) what America has to say.
It is important to send people while there are still challenges for colonists to solve. If we wait too long and send people who have the technology to take their lives with them, then no changes are made, no challenges conquered, and you end up with Australia (a nice tourist spot but not a world leader).

DEAR EVERYONE....

Do you have vision? Can you see the importance of a REAL space program with REAL goals? If you can then prove it showing your support of NASA's new Space Exploration Initiative. As we speak, members of congress are planning to kill NASA's first budget increase in years. Why? Because they believe that people don't care. They think that they can safely cut this program and be re-elected. Show them how wrong they are and support this program. But don't stop there...send it to anyone who might add their voice to this cause. Say NO to more dead heros because NASA doesn't have enough money to build a safer spacecraft.

http://www.space.com/goformars/

The problem with the russian made EVA suits are that they do have a shelf life. I also believe that these were also worn before.

The air leak was due to the crew using a window pane vaccum pressure line as a holsing handle for moving about inside the station.

As the station ages, more and more problems are going to continue to happen due impart to equipment that is poorly designed for the conditions of space.

You are right with the engineering skills being displayed by thoses that are actually working on space these days. They seem to be making very basic and silly errors.

Another thing that has been lost by going with specialists is the ablility to repair things when they break or to think outside of the box when problems arise. As was done when Apollo 13 had an O2 tank rupture.

Everyone wants to make the millions that the idols, the sports players and the other such false hero's make as compared to struggling agianst the tide of poverty or mid wage earning.

As for the other space faring nation they will only be there first if the American government lets them, by continually stripping away at the budgets of Nasa and of it's programs.

I am go for mars registered.

Updated article from the Florida today site for the spec's on Gyro's Photo and statement of russian's progress ship not able to bring up replacements.
Question what would be need by the Atlas or Delta rockets to bring these parts to the Station? Either of the rockets have the lift capability that would be needed. Also this would restore maybe a little face with the ISS partners.
To bad if it will cost a little to do this delivery. If not done it will cost Not only Nasa but America as well.

Thanks Harold, I knew I could count on you registering. I'm currently fleshing out a plan for a grass-roots effort to get to Mars.

As I see it: NASA has the funds to do it, but is tied up in red-tape and so many other projects that warrant it's attention. Organizations like the Mars Society have the driving goal and focus but not the money.

What I want to do is develop a real working scenario for getting people to Mars cheaply. Reuseable technology is the key. If we have to keep buildning new rockets then the average joe will never go.

(Takes a deep breath) Ok, here's what I've come up with so far, tell me why this won't work. I recently read a story about how new light-weight materials make possible the construction of ballons capable of reaching the edge of space. What I propose is that is should be possible to take it one step further. Once the balloon reached 50-60 miles altitude, cables then pull the balloon into a more flatter shape. The idea is to convert the balloon into a solar sail. Using the sun's light pressure, the ship could then spiral out of the atmosphere. I even suggest that ion-drive technology could be employed, not to propel the craft, but to negate the weight of the ship itself making the sail more efficent. A powerful ground-based laser could even assist the craft to leave orbit.

So there you have it. It's cheap, reuseable, light-weight. If the material were strong enough, it could even be used to aerobrake the craft into Mars orbit and then drift down to the surface slowly, no fuel needed.

Ideas? Comments?

Getting balloons to lift the required wieght will be the biggest obstical, as for solar sailing I think that is a current mission or is planned but not yet going, I saw something on this within the last few years. Some of the other technologies were or are being worked on by Nasa and the military with regards to lasers, beaming of energy to a target vehicle and other cuttin edge items. Reusable technology is something to keep working on but we must also work on ways to get something from nothing for free when it comes to propulsion and energy. Thats were solar panels, nuclear energy and mining operations come in once on the journey or at the colonizing site.
As far as building of more rockets that are expendable until automation is introduced into the manufacturing of them the cost will not go down. Effiency of fuel use to weight of payload versus thrust or lift must also be worked on in any of these designs to come.

Hear is the solar sail link for COSMOS 1
THE FIRST SOLAR SAIL. http://solarsail.jpl.nasa.gov/
http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/technology/cosmos_sail_030806.html
http://www.planetary.org/solarsail/index2.html
I am sure there are others.

here is a link on laser propulsion
http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/technology/laser_propulsion_000705.html
sort of an advance concept.

Thanks Harold! I would think the two technologies are meant to go together. Space balloons have to be large and light-weight to work and so do solar sails.
The organization most sucessful in using balloon technology is the Mars Society, I believe. They reached an altitude of over 100,000 feet with a realtively small balloon. Recently, and you probably read it too, there was an article on space.com about a company wanting to build gigantic balloons with pressurized capsules to take tourists to the edge of space. If someone can build a balloon that can reach an altitude of 50 miles or greater, then theres no reason this can't be done.

There are two groups that are part of the xprize competion that are using Helium Balloons for the start of there flight finishing to suborbital with solid or liquid rockets.

Neither balloons seem to be lifting very much and the altitude for rocket release is not all that high at 10km.

THE DA VINCI PROJECT Ship Name: Wild Fire
lift from balloon of rocket weight 500 kilograms (1,100 lbs released at 40,000 feet ,

IL Aerospace Technologies ship Name: NEGEV.
lift from balloon of rocket weight 3386 Kg (7464 lbm)released at 10 Km (32,808 feet)

Zach, by using the sun's light pressure and or ion-drive technology the acceleration speed is very limited. Trips in space will need more time, manned trips therefore will need more cargo. More cargo means less acceleration and so on. Braking needs a lot of time as well.
Furthermore I always thougt that "sun light sails would be extremely big and thus heavy, which makes this not realy suitable for balloon lift offs.
Maybe I should read the links first... but these were the comments that first came up to me.

While solar-sails may well be ineffective for most jobs, laser-sails are not. I believe a hybrid of ion propulsion and beaming laser energy will open up the solar system more than anything. Beaming energy has the distinct advantage of not increasing your crafts weight. Where solar sails would require sails hundreds of miles on one end, a laser sail could be much much smaller depending on your ultimate destination. Im thinking of a highly efficent and durable solar cell to collect incoming laser light to generate the energy needed for a powerful ion drive. I don't know why everyone seems so eager to close the books on ion-drive, I mean we just invented it and its still in its infancy. Thanks for the info Prozac and Harold. Have a great weekend!

I would say that solar sails have there place in long duration unmanned missions, the concept of beaming energy(microwave) to an advanced reciever would be like getting something for nearly free. The only problem is of refueling for ION drives eventually to they run out of fuel like any other rocket it just takes longer. Thats were launching chemical rockets to refuel the ION drive unit would prove to be useful. I know that I had mention this partial concept before but with a little matching of the rocket to destination I think it can be done.
So the big question is, what kind of long duration mission would this concept be good for.

Hey Harold, I've been giving your refueling idea some thought. if I understand you correctly, then you propose we have refueling stations at various destinations for interplanetary spacecraft. Well, as you've stated, the biggest problem besides getting fuel to the stations in the first place, is matching velocities between an incoming spacecraft and the refueling station. I was thinking this might not be such a problem, at least with planets that have atmospheres like Earth, Mars, Venus and Jupiter. We could use aerobraking I'm sure to decelerate incoming spacecraft in a way that leaves them in a similar orbit as the refueling stations. Or ships could be designed to deploy a sail when nearing their destinations and we could use light to slow them down. this would be useful at the Moon, Mercury, or other moons without atmospheres.

The best use for automated solar sails, I believe, would be to nudge comets into the poles of Mars. No one is likely to be living there even when we do start colonizing Mars and the extra water can't hurt. Or perhaps, after we sheild Venus from the sun, we could drop a bunch on Venus to give it some water.

Perhaps the best use of automated sails would be to adjust Near Earth Asteroid and comets into Earth orbit so that we have readily available resources for station construction and fuel.

Serveral probes have used aerobraking to slide into orbit. That also means a smaller rocket to get to the destination since you are not hauling all of the return trips fuel. That by itself reduces the number of stages needed if only by one.
The other concept is sort of an idea of that of a race track with the lead car is lapped and it must speed up to retake its place in the lead. A staggered launch time and speed differenctial could also be used if the slower unit has fuel to do a re-burn of main engines to bring it up to speed to taht of the approaching craft for refueling.
I like the idea of solar sails to bring natural resouces to mars or other destinations, couple that with regular or ION drive engines to start it moving in the right direction.
Comets for water or for adding mass from near earth asteriods a plus for teraforming Mars.

Zach: There is an ongoing discusion of Nasa's budget increase on the spacepolitics site http://www.spacepolitics.com/mt-comments.cgi?entry_id=156
I think this link will work.
Enjoy the reading.

Or how about railguns? I read a story somewhere about a team that built a pretty strong railgun out of 50 used car batteries. If it wouldn't take too many solar panels to produce that much energy in short bursts, we should be able to build a machine to do the following:
1)Land
2)Collect accurate positioning data in its relationship to say Mars
3)Unfold a solar array.
4)Deploy an automated digging machine, perhaps on a track.
5)Shoot 10 pounds at a time toward Mars' equator. (Future colonists will settle here primarily, and the added water and carbon from a comet would be most effective where the sun's rays are strongest.

At 10 pounds a minute, you are looking at 14,400 pounds a day. That's what, 7 tons a day? I don't know much about prevailing winds on Mars but surely most of the water vapor would stay in this region for awhile. Might even make it very comfortable for a lot of Earth plants =)